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kwok
February 5th, 2003, 4:38 AM
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i was just wondering what kind of practice time you put into your repsected instruments to be at the level you are at now.... and also how much you guys practice before the show..... also, i'd like to know why you guys play your songs exactly the same and never make any changes to them.... i'd like to note that my favourite out of all your songs is the "gong duo mo wai" song... the one with sandy playing the keyboard intro... that was a softer song with a nice clean melody that fit bonG's style... but the songs you guys write now never fit his range... and are so heavy with distortion and things like that that the melody is almost neglected... i want to know why you guys are going towards the heavy extreme and not the other way .... seeing that you have a singer with a great voice... anyways hope to see you guys on the 21st...
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kwok
February 5th, 2003, 4:47 AM
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sorry....... just want to make some corrections to my comment/questions... it is 5:40 am now so not very awake... the song i like the most is actually called "but seung nei lau ha"... that song has the nicest melody and and also the nicest drumline out of all your songs... in my opinion... maybe you just need to change the key .... like that fai wah song why not just raise the key so bonG could use his voice... i feel he was talking most of the time...
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vii
February 5th, 2003, 1:22 PM
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hi there, thanks for your precious comments.
i'm surprised that you find we play the songs the same way ever show. because every show i actually alter parts of the rhythm guitar or solos ever so slightly (and when permitted, the tone of my guitar as well). Also, the drum beats and fills change here and there every show as we not only have Bryce back on board, but he drums the old songs quite differently. we just came back from doing an entire acoustic set for Unicef last week where we basically played with bongos instead of drums, and an unplugged guitar sound and bass. You'll probably hear some of that in the near future (most likely not the 21st show though).
the whole deal with the keyboard thing and the "change" in type of music was mainly because the older songs (the one you mentioned) was a leftover song from when our band was still trying to group itself together. back then we had a female vocalist and the songs were more suited for that type of genre. however, by popular concensus amongst the band, that song was our least favorite and did not reflect what we want to do. if you know me, you'd probably know that i'm mostly on the heavy extreme in a band situation anyway, but so far we haven't compromised the melodies. traditional chinese pop has a very small influence on the band as half the band grew up here listening to other stuff. perhaps that's what's making you draw to this conclusion. however, i'm sure you'd find a good mix of softer pieces in our new set as it goes both extremes.
i'm sorry to hear that you do not like the melodies we create now as we take pride in them (with bon-g actually having a hand in the melodies as well). we do have a songs with cleaner parts as you will see on the 21st. the general approach to the songs is not using a traditional pop-style vocal to sing the songs. they were not written that way and, as the song suggests, it's about the daily trash talk you hear people talk about whether in your face or behind your back... most of the time, those remarks are made out in nothing less than a bark... please do remember, we're not conciously trying to make karaoke friendly songs/nor are we conciously trying not to. if the song turns out a way it does, it's basically because that's the way it was interpreted when we jammed it out as a band. while most of the ideas may start with one or two people writing at first, the end product is always a band effort and i don't think any one of us would disagree on that.
anyway, we all practice different amounts of times... some of us more than others *hint hint to those in the band reading this* =P ... but yeah, we hope you'll come check us out on the 21st and give us your support i'm glad that you took the time to listen to our songs and give us a critique... really. it means alot to us regardless of your view on it as you gave us your precious time to listen and comment on the songs.. thnx
-vincent
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c^2
February 5th, 2003, 11:30 PM
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Hey there..thanks for the critique..just wondering though..what exactly do you mean by playing them the same? do you mean our dynamics/tone? or style?
As to why we're going into the heavy extreme, I think we made a decision long ago to never go pop. ei-51 styles itself as a hard-rock group, and so our music reflects that.
However, that doesn't mean we don't play other genres. We've experimented with jazz and punk, as well as ballads. I personally believe that we do preserve the melody in our songs. If you remove the instrumentals, you'll find that the melody moves quite a bit more than is immediately apparent.
If we were to go to the other extreme, like go soft, then we would eventually be no different from any of the current hk acts out there, and that would totally run counter to what I want to do with music.
We also always write our songs with a mind towards bon-g's vocal range, but you'll have to ask bon-g himself about his actual range.
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Rutsu
February 6th, 2003, 10:48 PM
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Thank you for your comments. Bon-G does have a great voice for the slower, pop-style songs, but like Vii and C^2 said, our band just doesn't play that type of stuff, and we won't. Personally, I don't like the Canto-pop crap. But that's my point of view (not a direct representation of my band's point of view). On the 21st you'll hear hard stuff, and some soft stuff. I think our band is quite balanced when it comes to creating hard and soft songs. Perhaps you (Kwok), are more of a fan of pop-style songs, just like many Chinese music lovers. Part of the reason why I play is to get introduce this type of music to Chinese people, through Chinese lyrics. Sure you've heard rock over the radio, but it was in English. We want people like you to relate to our music, thus advancing rock music in Chinese cultre.
Like C^2 said, our songs still have a lot of melody carried out through Bon-g's parts. Trust me, it's quite hard to practice when it's just drums and bass....we need bon-g to carry the melody. So, at the next show....listen closely and try to feel where we're coming from. We don't want to blend with the more popular chinese music styles (I never really liked that stuff, as I grew-up as a 100% Canadian), and hopefully the new songs will appeal to you more.
Thanks so much for your comments, and I hope you will continue to support Ei-51.
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Rutsu
February 6th, 2003, 10:49 PM
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hahah, sorry for the grammar mistakes. I'm usually a grammar-nazi, but I'm totally doped out on drugs right now (caught a cold) so my brain isn't really here =)
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Bon-G
February 6th, 2003, 11:28 PM
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actually what do u mean that we play our songs the same way all the time? actually one of our songs 心聲 we actually changed the arrangement and we don't play it the same way as before. and then the 不想你留下 song we don't play anymore coz we don't really like it, haha, although u said it's ur favourite, maybe we can change it up a bit and play it in the future again, for that 廢話 song yes it's a bit low for my range, i can sing it in a higher key, but then they would have to play it differently, so it's all up to them, actually singing in the key now is not bad i think, coz not all songs have to be super high coz i will die if all the songs are like reaching my high range when i sing live in bandshow, plus my range is not that high anyways if u hear me sing u should know, and for the heavy distortion and things like that i think if we can actually adjust the volume and balance everything then u can actually hear my voice and the melody clearly, it's just that maybe the recording is not that good coz it's only demo that my voice seems to be covered by the music, and my voice isn't that soft actually so i can't sing the really really soft stuff, it will sound weird, and we actually have a bunch of new songs coming up for this upcoming show and we are probably going to record it too, hope u can give us some more comments on these new songs in the future and on the upcoming show, thanks
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kwok again
February 16th, 2003, 3:58 PM
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well........ i think you guys misinterpretted what i was trying to say.... haha..... i was trying to say...why don't you write songs according to your vocal's ability and strengths... it seems to me like you write all your songs .... and they all sound really white and loud and stuff...the guitars do but not the drums..... and then you add in... in my opinion... a vocal and melody that fits more of a pop flavour... which doesn't fit well in my opinion... if BonG you don't remember me i am the ugly short guy that came up to you at the AM1320 band show at continental and gave you a big thumbs up after i heard that song... it was very good... because it was one of the few songs that i thought fit your voice... and about your range... that water song... it is high for half the song...and is another example of what i mean when the songs don't fit your voice... but it fits your style.... and then most of your songs are way too low...and sometimes the songs don't fit your style but fits your voice... haha i listened to all your songs many times... live and on my computer... just MY observations and opinion ofcousre..... what i am trying to get at is... i think you guys should write songs for the singer..... and let the singer decide how the songs are .... and the key... and changing the way you play it isn't a problem at all...just means making the song work in another key...which shouldn't be a problem at all... just i think you guys should really listen to bonG ,,,he doesn't have a great voice for singing hard rock.... which is my opinion... you guys should maybe write songs that fit his voice... he is a very hk pop kind of person i think... and don't get me wrong i don't dislike you guys... i just want to know what you think of what i think... after i heard you guys at so many shows... i think your songs would be much better if you rearranged it ... and make the stuff more centered around the singing and not on blasting bass guitars... and guitar riffs that take away from the melody.... hope you understand what i mean... haha and about my taste in songs... i think the best conclusion i hvae a bout your band is... that it is too in the middle... you guys have a drummer and singer that doesn't fit the style of the guitars... and bass... id on't know i don't know much about bass... i just know it is too loud at every show... way too loud... itis funny because i listen to more metal and hardcore and white stuff stuff than any hk people i konw...and i mainly play heavier songs... and i also pay attention to the hk scene..... which i really dislike as well... well i will be there on the 21... hope you get what i mean this time... cheers...
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Rutsu
February 16th, 2003, 7:05 PM
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Kwok,
Thanks again. You say that you also play music? In a band? If so, then you will understand that a band plays to fit a majority. And since our songs are all original, we play to fit the composer and the certain song. Of course we need to think about Bon-G, but we think he is handling the songs quite well. If you've followed our band since the beginning, you will know that people come and go...especially vocals. If we played to fit Bon-g's style.. we wouldn't really be a band...we'd be a back-up band for a "singer". We got rid of keyboards because there is no place for it in our new songs...we got rid of our female vocalist because our band was changing as a WHOLE. We didn't attempt to fit her style. Bon-g's doing a wonderful job for us now, and I don't think we are one of the loudest/fuzziest/most distorted bands out there. If you were at the "Battle" at Viva in Dec, you will know that our band sounds totally different without Bon-G. The substitute vocalist may have had a rougher voice, but when considering everything, Bon-G is still the one for our band. I totally appreciate your comments and we have discussed them in our band room. Hopefully the show on the 21st will appeal to you and your taste and maybe some of your thoughts will change. A lot of people like our new style, but of course you have your right to feel how you feel. Regardless, your comments and time are much appreciated and we'll see you soon.
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vii
February 16th, 2003, 9:36 PM
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kwok, it's great to know that you actually give a shit about our band otherwise you wouldn't write comments for us. and i'm real grateful for that.
you know, alot of the points you raise are actually what i find special about this band. i personally like the way our band's structured now as opposed to a straight on metal band as that would limit the material i have to work with... sometimes i just feel like mellowing out and doing a few slow songs, sometimes i want to explore different avenues. at the same time, i didn't want to make a pop band either. and as you can hear, we ended up as a hard rock band fused with pop elements. it's really weird for us because in the past little while, we received alot of feedback from linsteners in mainland china. there was praise and also criticism, but alot of them thought we sounded too western... but singing in chinese. the weird thing is, half of us grew up here. it's more unnatural for us to make music that would sound like chinese pop... it's just not the sound that we heard as kids. and personally, as a musician, i always felt more natural to write riffs before the melody. it's just a different style of upbringing that's reflected in our music. lump that together with the other guys, and mix well, you get a good serving of ei-51 heheh.
you know, all of the song ideas get a bonG stamp of approval before we even start to jam them (this is a priveledge held exclusively by him too!) He's quite critical of our material sometimes and have rejected songs we made (T.T). but i guess what's left is what he wants to sing and he's doing it his way.
it's great that you think our music is kinda in the middle. i don't think it'd be fair to lump us into your everyday metal/hard rock categories... northe pop categories either for that matter. it gives a bit more of freedom in terms of music style that way.
well, hopefully the sound situation will be to our advantage this show maybe that'll let you hear what we really should sound like... i do have to agree, alot of the times the bass is too loud... and that's not even chris' doing... :P
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c^2
February 16th, 2003, 11:09 PM
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hey kwok, we really appreciate your input..it's not often that someone has the guts to criticize others..thank you for it.
Personally, I don't like a blasting bass either..I honestly didn't know the bass was too loud..from the amp on stage the sound's good, but i guess the soundman turned up the house speaker too much..
As for our song-writing, most of our song writing now is collaborative..one person kind of comes up with the main melody/chord progressions, then everyone else writes their parts, including bong..he takes the melody and alters it to whatever it is he's comfortable with..of course, we don't change it totally, because each of us has our own distinctive flavour, which we wouldn't want to lose. Like Bryce said..if we catered everything to bong, it'd be bong's band, not ei-51.
I also understand mixing a pop melody with heavy guitar riffs isn't normally done, butI believe that the fusion of chinese pop melody with english rock riffs is doable, and can be done well...the fusion kind of reflects us personally as well..a mixture of white culture and chinese culture.
Why don't you meet up with us after the show and then we'll discuss more?
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Anonymous
February 18th, 2003, 12:37 AM
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i think u are right that i am a pop kind of singer, but then i am learning how to sing rock too, so maybe i sound kind of pop singing rock songs, haha, but then i think i have improve over time and now i don't sound as pop as before when singing in the band, and i think u can't ask the guys to write everything for my style coz then it will just turn into a pop band, but then ei-51 is a rock band, i am supposed to interpret that kind of music thru my voice, although i guess i am not doing a good job singing hard rock according to ur opinions, haha, which i kind of agree too, coz i have been singing pop songs for so many years but i have just been singing more hard rock stuff since i join the band, which is only about less than 2 years, when i listen to the very old recordings of our songs, i find it funny to listen to myself sing in a very pop way for the songs that we wrote, ahha, but now i think i sing a bit differently than before and i don't sing the same way when i sing the songs for our band than for songs such as those in karaoke, anyways i think i still have a lot to improve in singing in a rock band and i really appreciate ur comments and i hope that u will enjoy our show on friday, haha, maybe we can discuss about our music after the show as chris said
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Bon-G
February 18th, 2003, 12:37 AM
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that was me though, forget to put my name, haha
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Alan
February 27th, 2003, 8:52 PM
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kwok why are you caring so much about how they make their own music?
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